Nuclear Suicide by Embrittled Reactors:
Veteran environmental investigative journalist Karl Grossman

This Week’s Featured Interview:

  • Karl Grossman is an author and journalism professor at the State University of New York/College at Old Westbury. He hosts the television program Enviro Close-Up with Karl Grossman, is the author of six books, and writer of numerous magazine, newspaper and Internet articles. That doesn’t even come close to describing his talents, abilities and accomplishments. Karl has been covering nuclear issues for over 50 years, and in terms of knowing how things came about and where the bodies are buried – that’s a metaphor, we hope – nobody does it better. Karl has been an important early and consistent supporter of Nuclear Hotseat, and we talk with him here about the Nuclear Regulatory Commission’s latest deadly shenanigans and hijinks – or as Karl calls it, “baloney” – as regards nuclear reactor operations. We talked on February 5, 2021.
  • LINK to Karl Grossman and Harvey Wasserman’s article:  Embrittlement in Nuclear Power Plants
  • LINK to Arnie Gundersen of Fairewinds Energy Education with “Nuclear Crack Down,” a demonstration of embrittlement.
  • Karl Grossman’s superb book, Cover Up! What you are not supposed to know about nuclear power

Numnutz of the Week (for Outstanding Nuclear Boneheadedness):

So the Radioactive Olympics are not just routing the proposed torch run through Fukushima’s radioactive hot spots, scheduling WOMEN’S softball games at Fukushima’s Azuma Sports Stadium, and ignoring the Covid 19 pandemic… they’re also flat-out sexist???

LINKS:


Libbe HaLevy 

00:00:02

Bug captured and compliant us nuclear regulatory commission. It’s currently discussing whether to allow nuclear reactors, which were built to be safely operated for only 40 years and additional 20 year license extension, bringing the potential operating life, not to 60 years, which they’ve already done or two 80 years, which they’ve already done, but to 100 years, a full century, despite the known, documented dangers of doing so, but then a genuine expert tells you that the danger is not in the NRC giving reactors the go ahead for extended operating licenses. But

Karl Grossman

00:00:43

The NRC also allows the utilities to operate the nuclear plants. In other words, to have them run hotter and harder. Imagine being on an interstate and a car, which is 60 years old or 80 years old, or a century old going at high speed. Again, these nukes have been operated, but here it isn’t just one car breaking down with nuclear power plants. You’re talking about absolutely huge disasters, affecting millions and millions of people. It is patently insane.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:01:20

Well when veteran environmental, investigative reporter Carl Grossman lays out exactly what it would mean to allow a nuclear reactor to reoperate at high hot speed for 100 years. Not that we know that that’s even possible. You start to realize that the temperature is going to keep going up and up and up for that deadly seat that we all share

Announcer

00:01:45

Clear hot seat. What are those people thinking? Nuclear? Hotsy what have those boys been braking clear? Hotsy the Ms. Sinking our time to act is shrinking, but the visceral Hotsy, it’s the bomb.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:02:16

Welcome to nuclear hot seat. The weekly international news magazine, keeping you up to date on all things nuclear from a different perspective. My name is Leiby Halevi. I am the producer and host as well as a survivor of the nuclear accident at three mile island from just one mile away. So I know what can happen when those nuclear so-called experts get it wrong. This week, one of my favorite interviewees veteran, environmental journalist, Carl Grossman, he explains the dangers of allowing nuclear reactors to run beyond their design basis of 40 years and the nuclear regulatory commissions, recent hearings on allowing them a 100 year operating license. Carol knows where the nuclear bodies are buried and brings his wealth of information and understanding to the problems caused by aging reactor embrittlement and what the real risks are. If the NRC and its buddies in the nuclear industry get their way, we will also have nuclear news from around the world numnuts of the week for outstanding nuclear bone headedness, and more honest nuclear information than will be ever mentioned during this week’s impeachment hearings.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:03:31

All of it coming up in just a few moments today is Tuesday, February 9th, 2021. And here is this week’s nuclear news from a different perspective, starting off in the United States where the push to make New Mexico, the de facto nuclear sacrifices zone for the country is moving forward a pace, but not without significant pushback by local communities. One of the steps to store our highly radioactive waste in New Mexico comes with a plan to dispose of surplus plutonium at the waste isolation pilot plant near Albuquerque, the linguistic manipulation around this calls for a dilution process that would reduce the waste to radiation levels allowable at the facility. First of all, allowable is an arbitrary number that has been put together by the nuclear industry with their cronies at the nuclear regulatory commission doesn’t mean it’s safe. It just means they let it happen. And the concept of dilution, dilution of radioactive waste is a false one.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:04:42

Dilution is what happens when you take something that is a poison and you keep adding other things to it. So it becomes less and less and less potent to the point where it doesn’t harm you at all. But the smallest exposure to anything radioactive that is dangerous is one Adam, and you cannot dilute one atom. What they would really be doing is dispersion, meaning spreading the radioactive atoms over a larger area, mixed with a larger amount of other materials. Note that the waste isolation, pilot plant or whip is only licensed to accept low level transuranic waste such as radiated materials used during nuclear research and other activities such as clothing and equipment, not highly radioactive plutonium. What specifically under discussion is 34 metric, tons of highly radioactive waste. Now stored at the Pantex plant in Northern Texas and Savannah Riverside in South Carolina, all of which would have to be shipped over land and over rail through communities just to get to whip.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:05:53

There is strong pushback against this coming from members of the local state government in New Mexico and groups, such as the indigenous led nuclear waste study group based in Albuquerque and national environmental and anti-nuclear groups in Washington state workers at the Hanford nuclear reservation have begun to retrieving radioactive waste from another of the nuclear reservations, 149 leak prone underground waste tanks to date. The department of energy has only completed waste retrieval from 17 of its 149 single shell tanks. Some of them built in the 1940s and at least one of the 132 tanks you have to be emptied is leaking waste into the ground below this marks. The first time that DOE contractor Washington river protection solutions has started emptying waste from a tank since August of 2019 in Maryland elevated radiation levels were detected in the containment building of the research neutron reactor at the national Institute of standards and technology in Gaithersburg, which is only 19 miles from Washington DC, several trained radiation workers were exposed to elevated levels and were undergoing quote standard decontamination and evaluation.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:07:21

The government is saying that there is no evidence of radiation above regulatory limits outside the containment buildings, but some nearby residents hadn’t received an official notification of the radiation exposure and expressed concern in Ohio. The new owners have to have that state’s nuclear power plants have given indications that they are no longer interested in receiving as much as $1 billion in subsidies that were handed out in a tainted energy bill. The legislation known as house bill six resulted in a $60 million bribery case involving X, Ohio state speaker, Larry householder, who was alleged to help prop up the legislation to provide these subsidies. Now a new bill Senate bill 44 is legislation that would eradicate these subsidies that would have been paid by electric customers across the states where the plants, which are now held privately by a company called energy Harbor, Ohio consumers, councils, Bruce Weston said in a statement it’s quite a turnaround of energy.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:08:33

Harbor is now telling the legislature to repeal its billion dollar corporate welfare subsidy from Ohioans questions that come to mind include did the two nuclear plants really need the subsidy that they got from Ohio and state government and were the nuclear plants really going to be closed without the subsidy and former public utilities commission of Ohio chaired Todd Schnitzler called HB six, eight quote, shameful piece of legislations Ohioans don’t need to pay more only to support struggling nuclear plants, a new poll undertaken by the Federation of American scientists think tank together with rethink media shows that the majority of voters do not want billions spent a new ICBM missiles to overhaul America’s nuclear sponge. That’s what they’re calling it. The us air force continues to move ahead with plans to replace its LG M 30 G Minutemen three Intercontinental ballistic missiles with the future ground-based strategic deterrent or GBSD at a total cost of around $264 billion.

Libbe HaLevy 

00:09:46

Think how many solar panels that would pay for the survey found that 64% of the people polled 800 registered us voters where the pool supported delaying the GBSD and 60% supported one of any various alternative policies to deploying the future GB SDS and two links to articles that will fill in this picture. The first is a mammoth one. It could practically be an ebook on its own from the bulletin of the atomic scientists, the bulletin.org entitled. Why is America getting a new $100 billion nuclear weapon describing it as a nuclear missile, the limp of a bowling alley capable of traveling some 6,000 miles carrying the warhead more than 20 times, more powerful than the atomic bomb dropped on Hiroshima, that we’ll be able to kill hundreds of thousands of people in a single shot. And the us air force plans to order more than 600 of them.

Libbe HaLevy 

01:10:47

Well, if we want to turn the planet into an asteroid belt Beth, a dandy way to do so, but the bulletin is much more articulate than that. And you can find the link up on our website, nuclear hot seat.com under this episode, number 5, 0 3. And if you haven’t subscribed to the bulletin.org, you can really do yourself a favor and do so because their articles are great. And I use them for source all the time. The other link is to an article from the hill.com entitled the U S should negotiate a ban on basing weapons in space. Here, here, we’ve had Bruce Gagnin of space for peace.org, as well as today’s guest Carl Grossman on the show discussing this issue at length. And you will find links up on the website episode 5 0 3, over to Japan for this week’s

Libbe HaLevy 

01:11:49

If you still need evidence of what a cluster the Olympics are and the thinking that is behind it, look no further than this week’s remarks by Tokyo Olympics, chief yo Shiro, Maury, the 83 year old former prime minister has already continued to ignore the radiation hotspots along the Olympic torch relay, ignore radiation problems and readings at the first women’s softball and baseball games set for Fukushima’s Azuma baseball stadium, ignore the rising costs and ever-growing public opposition to the games to say nothing of the ongoing Corona virus pandemic and declare that the 2020 Olympics will take place in 2021. Even with the wrong date on all the preprinted Birch. In addition to all that this week, Maury further stuck his foot in it and insulted women everywhere. By suggesting that women talked too much in meetings, his comments demeaning women took place during an online executive meeting of the Japanese Olympic committee, no closed doors to hide behind here.

Libbe HaLevy 

01:12:57

The whole world was listening. When asked to comment on the Olympic committees plan to increase the number of women board members to more than 40% of the total big whoop. It still assumes men deserve the majority position. Maury said, you have to regulate speaking time to some extent or else we’ll never be able to finish. And other statements implying that women talked too much comments that were met with laughter. They may not be laughing now as international complaints against his comments have been building. And it’s now reported that at this moment, 390 volunteers for the Olympics and the para Olympics have resigned including two Torchbearers. Well, if awareness of radiation, hotspots and the propaganda that has been building against evacuees from Fukushima isn’t enough to cancel the radio active Olympics, perhaps antediluvian backwards thinking blatant sexism is, and that’s why 83 year old has anyone checked him for Alzheimer’s lately Olympics, chief, you know, Shiro, Maury, you are this week’s no.

Announcer

01:14:08

Okay. Your hot seat, none awake

Libbe HaLevy 

01:14:13

Over to the UK where their nuclear decommissioning authority or NDA has relaunched it search for a site for a geological depository facility for nuclear waste. And one option that is actually being considered is to build it under the Irish sea, up to 22 kilometers or 13 and a half miles from Sellafield and within seven miles of the isle of man territorial waters, Peter Christian of the isle of man friends of the earth said the proposal to transport nuclear waste to a location underneath the Irish sea is not supportable. The history of storage of such highly dangerous substances is littered with incidents of contamination, inadequate containers and sealant, erosion cracking human error, and they have been found to pose significant risks. The nuclear waste industry itself has flagged up potential problems of ventilation and if necessary retrieval of hazardous substances, we should no longer consider the Marine environment as infinitely capable of soaking up.

Libbe HaLevy 

01:15:19

Our human wastes as has been done so often with explosive and toxic munitions and whatever else has been dumped at sea. The preferred option of the NDA is close to, or actually under isle of man territorial waters, something which the government should also oppose as the first ever treaty to ban nuclear weapons has entered into force. India said that it does not support the treaty and shall not be bound by any of the obligations that may arise from it. The treaty on the prohibition of nuclear weapons was approved by the United nations general assembly in 2017 and entered into international force of law on January 21st of this year, at the same time, India has reiterated its commitment to the goal of a nuclear weapons free world. Yeah. How about participating in it? Meanwhile word comes that Cuba has become the latest nation to ratify the treaty on the prohibition of nuclear weapons on January 29th EU today hosted a conference at the press club in Brussels, concentrating on the new and proposed nuclear power plants in Bellaruse Turkey and Uzbekistan moderator, Natalia Richardson, drew parallels between the risks surrounding nuclear energy today and that your noble disaster of 1986, of which she, as a student in Ukraine at the time had experience keynote speaker jut help.

Libbe HaLevy 

01:16:50

Halsall a German green member of parliament who sits on the European Parliament’s committee on the environment, public health and food safety told the conference that at present nuclear energy may supply around 10% of the global demand for electricity, but to maintain this level taking into account rising demand and the decommissioning of existing aging out reactors, new builds will need to come online at a rate of 55 0 per year, which is impossible. We’ll have this week’s featured interview in just a moment, but first nuclear problems are going to continue to be with us forever. From uranium mining to weapons, production, to radiation, leaking reactors, to still not having a way to safely store the deadly radioactive waste produced by all these endeavors. Nuclear is government and business, not caring how they contaminate the world as long as they keep making obscene profits and fool themselves into thinking they are immune to the consequences of their actions, even though they are not.

Libbe HaLevy 

01:17:54

Meanwhile, we all have to deal with the dangers of radioactive contamination that will not go away on its own. Ever quite frankly, nuclear is a mess. That’s why you need nuclear hot seat. You’ve learned to count on us to get into nuclear stories with facts, continuity and context, as well as skepticism with a much deeper and nuanced telling than you would ever expect. In mainstream media, we get behind the scenes under the skin and into the heart of nuclear matters every week with fresh information and unrelenting perspective, and even whenever possible with humor. That’s why the time would be right now to support us with a donation. It’s the only way we are able to keep going. You can do so easily by just going to nuclear hot seat.com. There’s a big red donate button there. If you click on it, follow the prompts. You can help us with a donation of any size that same red button is now where you can set up a monthly $5, the same as a cup of coffee, and a nice tip here in the U S so please do what you can and do it now and know that however much you can help.

Libbe HaLevy 

01:19:08

I am deeply grateful that you are listening and that you care. Here’s this week’s featured interview and it’s with one of my favorite interviewees. Carl Grossman is an author and journalism professor at the state university of New York college of old Westbury. He hosts the television program in viral closeup with Carl Grossman is the author of six books and writer of numerous magazine, newspaper, and internet articles. Carl has been covering nuclear issues for over 50 years. And in terms of knowing how things came about and where the bodies are buried, that’s a metaphor when we hope nobody does it better. Carl has been an important early and consistent supporter of nuclear hot seat. And we talked with him about the nuclear regulatory commissions, latest deadly shenanigans and hi-jinks, or as Carl calls it baloney as regards to nuclear reactor operations. We talked on February 5th, 2021, Carol Grossman. It is always a joy to have you with us on nuclear hot seat.

Karl Grossman

02:20:15

A pleasure always to be with you living.

Libbe HaLevy 

02:20:19

Let’s talk about nuclear reactors when they were first built, their operating life expectancy was 40 years after which time the engineers said they would have to be decommissioned. Why was that?

Karl Grossman

02:20:33

Well, it had to do with embrittlement and radiation it’s metal. The metal becomes extremely brittle. And as a result back when nuclear power began, this was, and it was correct thinking that after 40 years, these plants would be unsafe to operate because of embrittlement of metals.

Libbe HaLevy 

02:20:58

The U S nuclear regulatory commission has repeatedly provided 20 or extensions on the operating licenses of us nuclear reactors. First two 60 years now in certain instances to 80 years. And they are actually in the middle of discussing being able to provide an additional 20 years to 100 years of operation. What’s wrong with this picture?

Karl Grossman

02:21:22

Well, it’s utterly nuts. It’s crazy. And here, in fact, I’m quoting Bob Alvarez say former senior policy advisor at the us department of energy and a PSA wrote it appeared on counterpunch and nation of change. He’s also the coauthor of killing our own, the disaster of America’s experience with atomic radiation. No reactor in history has lasted that long. In fact, the oldest nuclear power plant in the United States, it went for 49 years. It was the oyster Creek plant in New Jersey, and it was closed in 2018. So here the nuclear regulatory commission, which well it’s acronymed NRC, but that should stand for nuclear, rubber stamp commission has said yes to the decades to whatever the nuclear industry wants. And just important to understand that the nuclear industry is, is sinking. Nuclear power is in its doldrums. I mean the only nuclear power plants being constructed in the United States are the Vogel three and four nukes and Georgia and the cost.

Karl Grossman

02:22:39

And it’s way over the original cost estimate. Now it’s $28 billion for these two plants and the price is still rising beyond the three mile island disaster beyond the, the shin noble catastrophe beyond the Fukushima disaster. And meanwhile, there’s safe, clean green, renewable energy led by solar and wind. Nuclear is not necessarily, and people do not want nuclear power. That’s why there’s only two nukes being built in the United States. And the number of nuclear plants in the U S is now down from 1 29 to 94. So the nuclear industry is just a desperate to stay alive. So it figures what it could do is instead of keeping with this a 40 year limit in terms of the operating licenses for nuclear power plants, their butts consider their operating life to extend that to 60 years. And that’s already been done and most nuclear power plants in the U S now because of the nuclear stamp commission have been given the okay to go 60 years.

Karl Grossman

02:23:50

And then the NRC has given a number of plants. The go ahead to go for 80. And now it’s talking about a hundred as Bob Alvarez, who is an expert, as he says, it’s crazy. This could be national suicide, and that’s not hyperbole. I mean, and you’d have another disaster, like focus Shima in this country. One other thing I should mention in giving the, go ahead for these extending operating licenses, the NRC also allows the utilities to operate the nuclear plants. In other words, to have them run hotter and harder. Imagine being on an interstate and a car, which is 60 years old or 80 years old, or a century old going at high speed. Again, these nukes have been operated. There’s going to be a problem. There’s going to be a breakdown, but here it isn’t just one car breaking down with nuclear power plants. You’re talking about absolutely huge disasters, affecting millions and millions of people. It is patently insane to do around nuclear power plants. I don’t think I should run for a week. I don’t think I should run for a day, but to run for a period of 68, a hundred years is absolutely asking for catastrophe,

Libbe HaLevy 

02:25:14

Talk to us about embrittlement what it is and what it does and why it is so dangerous and why it gets worse. The longer a nuclear reactor runs.

Karl Grossman

02:25:25

I just wrote a big article with Harvey Wasserman. He was one of the folks that got together and coined that term no nukes years ago. He also was a co-author of the book killing our own, the disaster of America’s experience with atomic radiation. And he did an interview with Arnie Gunderson and on a, who you know, was a nuclear engineer for, for decades still is, but he’s an independent nuclear engineer now. And as he explained the situation and it’s in the article, which I wrote with Harvey, which is in the nation of change, counter crunch, other outlets, as he explains it, when radiation hits metal, it wreaks havoc with the metal. And as a result, you can’t depend on that steel. You can’t depend on that metal, including the metal or, or around the core. The nuclear core is in a nuclear power plant. The deal is with a problem with loss of coolant affecting a nuclear power plant, a meltdown accident, the remedy is to use what’s called an emergency core cooling system.

Karl Grossman

02:26:38

It’s a series of, of showers, which would shower down cold the, of the core containment of a nuclear power plant that, that cold water hitting hot and brittle metal, the game’s over as on a Gunderson, put it, think of what happened at Fukushima. Think of what happened at Chernobyl. An explosion can, can easily occur a plume of radioactive poisons. Couldn’t be formed containments incidentally, a nuclear power plants to go back to allowing these old decrepit nuclear power plants in the U S and not to incidentally the average age of nuclear power plants in the U S all 94 of them now is 40 years, 40 years. And as I cite in the articles, Harvey and I growed, I cite a U S government document, which says that in 2019, they were 39 years old, the average nuclear power plant in the United States. Now it’s 2021. So they’re all at this point, the average age for all the nuclear plants, all 94 of them, the U S is 40 they’re. Now, beyond now, beyond that limit set, when nuclear power began

Libbe HaLevy 

02:27:59

The part of the quote from Arnie Gunderson in the article you wrote with Harvey Wasserman, and we will link to it up on the website with this interview. The quote that really got me was where he said that if embrittlement happens and there is an accident that the container vessel would shatter like glass and that put it more powerfully than I’ve heard it before now to buck itself up, the nuclear industry has put a lot of money into its PR and propaganda to convince the world that it is a quote, unquote hurts me to even say this clean green technology and is, and I choke on these words, carbon free your response to those claims.

Karl Grossman

02:28:44

Well, it’s just the latest installment of nuclear bologna from these nuclear Pinocchios. I remember years ago, the notion was Louis. the chairman of the atomic energy commission proclaimed that nuclear power would be electricity, too cheap to meter. Now, the newest pitch is that nuclear power is carbon free. What the nuclear industry doesn’t want to say. It doesn’t want to talk about it. In fact, it’s carbon intensive. When you talk about the nuclear fuel cycle, mining, milling, and Richmond, in fact, nuclear power plants themselves. I met carbon 14, a radioactive form of carbon. It’s just another big lie by the nuclear industry.

Libbe HaLevy 

02:29:34

So what do we say to people who claim that genuinely sustainable energy technologies like solar geothermal, hydro electric title, and anything else that’s been created? All of that would never be able to generate power enough to replace nuclear

Karl Grossman

02:29:51

It’s untrue. And not only will the union of concerned scientists published a book actually exactly 30 years ago, coal renewables are ready at this point. Renewables are more than ready and renewables could at this point, easily, easily replace coal, replace oil, replace gas, and replace nuclear, renewable, safe, green, clean energy, solar, and wind lead it. But this title and there’s wave power, and there’s other forms of safe, green, renewable energy. This is energy we can live with not energy that we’d end up dying with.

Libbe HaLevy 

03:30:36

There’s a new administration in charge in Washington, DC. What is within the power of president Biden to do, to get the problems at the NRC and with these aging nuclear reactors under control and prevent what you have recently referred to in the article as nuclear suicide,

Karl Grossman

03:30:56

What Harvey and I say, and that piece is that Biden should order inspections, regard to embrittlement every nuclear power plant in the United States. And if there’s, embrittlement shut them down, absolutely shut them down by this not perfect. Biden’s done perfect. And even though years and years ago, as a Senator, he was very concerned about the Salem nuclear power plant, which was a crust we lived in Delaware, which has been problem plague for years. He’s been sold a bill of goods quite unfortunately, by the nuclear industry and its proponents, its proponents and government, and he’s for advanced nuclear power. In other words, new and improved nukes. Well, they’re not, these are just old ideas being wheeled out again. They’re not circling improved and secondarily he’s his boy BS that to deal with climate change, to deal with global warming, we must go to nuclear. I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s like going from crack cocaine to heroin or vice versa.

Karl Grossman

03:32:09

The wise thing that president Biden should do in my view is to, I mean, he’s talked about sending this country into a needed transition to renewables, but that should be full throated. I’m going again, the renewables they’re more than ready. Nuclear power plants take years. Okay. Or more to construct. So when the, these other safe, clean green energy forms, it could be put into operation very, very quickly. What Biden I think should do. I mean, he should certainly have these nukes didn’t do in regard to embrittlement, but I think he should shut them all down. Immediately shut them all down and have this country move to a hundred percent renewable after the nuclear rubber stamp commission. It grows that of what I mentioned, Louis straws and the U S atomic energy commission. Finally in 1974, it was abolished by the us Congress, many members then, and now in the pocket of the nuclear industry for being in conflict of interest for somehow regulating and promoting at the same time nuclear technology.

Karl Grossman

03:33:26

So what occurred was that a nuclear so-called regulatory commission was created to kind of be an objective entity to look into nuclear. It’s not been an objective it’s it’s, it’s been a promotional entity from its outset. And then eventually the U S department of energy was created in it. It was to have the promotional role to, to put nuclear power, which it’s, it’s done to a fare thee well, but Justin in recent days. And this is so disturbing. President Biden appointed Christopher Hansen as the new chair of the nuclear regulatory commission. Guess where Christopher Hanson comes from the department of energy’s office of nuclear energy. So years he pushed and nukes, and now he’s going to push nukes at the NRC. I mean, this is the way it’s been from the outset for a variety of reasons. The nuclear industry has had a hold on the U S government and furthermore, and we’ve discussed this before on your program, living the Manhattan project, it gave birth to a vested interest.

Karl Grossman

03:34:43

This was the crash program to build nuclear weapons, atomic bombs during world war two. And with the world war being over the folks in the Manhattan project, the engineers and the scientists, Hey, worked on building more nuclear bombs and bigger and better nuclear WAM, better not right in quotes, Edward tellers. It was the father of the, the bigger one, the hydrogen bomb, but then they worried, well, what else clear how many nuclear weapons can we build? It can’t even sell a nuclear weapon to an ally. Why can we do with nuclear power to somehow perpetuate the vested interests that would develop during the Manhattan project? So they thought about, oh, and actually built an airplane, which took was to be powered by a nuclear reactor problem was how are you going to shield the pilots from the radioactivity? Put it a lot of lead, but the plane would be too heavy, nuclear powered rockets, which I’ve done a lot of work on.

Karl Grossman

03:35:43

I mean, that’s not over at all plans to use nuclear and space, radiation, zapping, strawberries, and potatoes. So you could eat them in 20 years. If you wanted to eat a 20 year old brick and finally nuclear power plants in part, I mean, this was the original scheme to produce plutonium for weapons. Then like a Saki bomb was a plutonium atomic bomb. Most of our atomic bomb since plutonium based some manmade elements, the hydrogen bomb it’s trigger as plutonium and secondarily. I mean, this is the original steam dual-purpose react as they call them was to produce electricity GE and Westinghouse. And it’s only where major contractors in the Manhattan project program. And then subsequently GE and Westinghouse became the Coke and Pepsi of nuclear power plants. 80% of nuclear power plants worldwide are of GE or Westinghouse design or manufacturer. And so out of the Manhattan project comes, frankly, got nuclear cult within government pushing nuclear at the nuclear rubber stamp commission.

Karl Grossman

03:36:54

But now at the U S department of energy and then their PR effect my first book on nuclear power coverup, what you’re not supposed to know about nuclear power starts off with my saying that you have not been told you have not been informed because of an army of PR people, public relations, people from the outset, pushing from the outset to suppress as a call the book, coverup information about nuclear technology and to sell it. Now, the current pitches I say is that we need it because of climate change. No, we need safe green clean energy forms, not nuclear. So we’ve had a problem with for many years and the struggle continues.

Libbe HaLevy 

03:37:38

Speaking of that struggle, I know that listeners to nuclear hot seat, a lot of them are very motivated to be involved, get involved, stay involved in these issues whenever they can. What might we do to support the president or to create more noise around what the nuclear regulatory commission is doing so that perhaps we can get them to knock it off.

Karl Grossman

03:38:06

I’m a firm believer in grassroots action, bottom up action. People working from the grass roots and there’s some excellent organizations around I’m on the board. In fact of beyond nuclear, a Superbowl group based in Tacoma park in Maryland, near Washington nuclear information and resource service, a Superbowl group, excellent group also based in Tacoma park Greenpeace, a wonderful group in terms of fighting challenging nuclear power. The radiation and public health project is a very fine group based in New Jersey. In fact, I’m on its board too. And that focuses in on you don’t need a catastrophe for people to end up dying because of nuclear power dying, largely because of cancer, nuclear power plants are allowed permissible admissions. They call it to send out radioactivity in the form of gas in terms of the coolant, whatever it comes out of the nuclear power plant and so forth.

Karl Grossman

03:39:13

And as a result, there’s cancer clusters around every nuclear power plant and nuclear understood where to talk about this. But the radiation and public health project with Joe Montana was the executive director has long been the epidemiology. I think people should connect with these organizations. A lot of the big environmental organizations. I’m sorry to say aren’t with it on nucleus. Some are some aren’t, but the organizations that had just named those four or five and grease between pizza, isn’t a small little localization itself. And somehow try to educate, try to educate president Biden. Kamala Harris incidentally has been critical of nuclear, and maybe she could get the president’s ear. However, in the democratic platform, there’s a commitment to nuclear power. I mean, folks out there who are Democrats have to, I think have this ship of democratic state change course. And as people become aware, even people in government who sometimes are hard to convince and hard to get to the ship of democratic state, the ship upstate period can be changed.

Karl Grossman

04:40:25

That there’s also a number of Congress. People who are superior on this issue. One being Edward Markey of Massachusetts, Senator from Massachusetts, working with Marquis, anybody listening to the shows from Massachusetts, supporting ed Markey, working with ed Markey, very important. But in my view, nuclear power is this is a matter of life and death. We don’t want to end up like the people in Japan around focus, FEMA. So many dead with cancer. They’ve had to leave their homes. The people who lived around, I mean the greatest research work on the Chernobyl disaster was done by a team of European scientists led by a guy Dr. Alexa ya’ll, block-off the embodies, the Rachel Carson of Russia. That book concluded. It was published by the New York academy of sciences. A few years ago. That’s a guest toll, the death toll as a result of the Shinola disaster in 1989 was near a million near a million from the fallout.

Karl Grossman

04:41:31

And it wasn’t just in Bella. Rusyn brushed them in the Ukraine, but Zack radioactive plume spread around the world say it was fallout. Then wherever there was an impact. And they look at the impact in terms of where there was heavy full-out cancer rate spiking and so forth. So, I mean, this is a life and death situation and, and brittle nuclear power plants in the United States being allowed now to operate 60 and 80, a hundred years, a hundred years. As I say, it’s just absolutely asking for disaster as to that nuclear rubber stamp commission. It had a public held a public meeting a few weeks ago, and well, the public meeting was on the here’s the here’s the title of the document that folks were supposed to comment on development of guidance documents to support the word support license renewal for a hundred years of plant operations. And as Paul Gunter, director of the reactor oversight project of beyond nuclear said, our position is a resounding no, or Erika gray. She’s the nuclear issues chair of the Virginia Sierra club. It’s time to stop this whole new con job said Eric Gray. There’s no solution to dealing with radioactive waste and it’s unethical to continue to make the most toxic waste known to mankind, renewable and energy led by solar and wind can power the whole world,

Libbe HaLevy 

04:43:15

Which is of course what we should be aiming at. So given that in your long history of publishing terrific articles on the truth about nuclear, this most recent one about embrittlement that you and Harvey Wasserman wrote together for counterpunch and all the other places where it has shown up what has been the response, if any, that you’ve received so far to the article and the information that was in it,

Karl Grossman

04:43:40

We’ve gotten very strong, great complements, strong support. Then I’ve also gotten emails and I’m open to emails from folks said, but we need nuclear. I mean, there may be problems, but because of climate change and I respond just like I just responded a few minutes ago with the information about how nuclear is not carbon free, some right to have written to me, if I can engineer from your way from, from California said, you gotta put these advanced reactors, you know, the 3m react. And then I have to spend 20 minutes writing about how these new improved nukes are not new, but not improved. They’re not advanced. They produced nuclear waste to prone, to accidents, to and so forth and so on. But in general, when people are informed and I’ve been on the lecture circuit for years on the nuclear issue. In fact, we talked to many years ago and I really had to sharpen my presentation.

Karl Grossman

04:44:37

My lecture agency had me debate John Sununu, John Sununu was the white house chief of staff for the first Bush. And we had a series of debates in the beginning. Interestingly enough, Sununu insisted in the contract cause he knew my book cover up. And how I wrote the book was to reprint as facsimiles, all these kinds of documents in regard to nuclear technology from the government from incorporations and the deal was no slides, no books, no PowerPoint. They’re going to debate. And then you have a husband or I am a nuclear engineer, says syndrome whose father incidentally worked for Westinghouse. So there’s a lineage there. What are you? You’re a journalist. When I said, what I tried to do is to dredge up the facts, to get to the facts. And the second debate I had insisted to the lecturer, I gotta be able to show the slides.

Karl Grossman

04:45:34

I got to be able to start documentation. And I did. And I did successively with send Nunu, which have disappointed John Sununu. But I have found when people get the information, I mean, after the presentations I’ve given and all over my lecture agency has booked me to technological schools, Ohio Institute of technology, Louisiana. I think it’s called technology Institute and so forth. And when I happened to inform the young people in the audience who I thinking of going into the new history about how they are allowed to absorb many times more the radioactivity than the average person, what I’m going to get into this, I’m going to walk into the nuclear lion’s den. Even those folks who have been, have they been brainwashed, frankly, they’ve been conditioned by people in the nuclear culture to think that it’s all fine and dandy it’s nuclear power, the best thing to come along cliche since sliced bread.

Karl Grossman

04:46:34

It is not it’s poisoned bread as John Goffman, who was one of the rare kind of people who he was socio director at Lawrence Livermore laboratory. He was involved with the Manhattan project, but he finally understood. He finally understood how lethal this was. And he became, speaking of being a whistleblower coming out and his great book is poisoned power or another great example, I think is Hyman Rickover I’m in Hyman, Rick, over the father of the nuclear Navy. He was in fact in charge of the first nuclear power plant built in the U S in shipping port in Pennsylvania. He might, he retired from the Navy in 1982. You can see his speech on Google and the newer additions of coverup. I reprint two pages, essentially what he says, what he says is billions of years ago, there couldn’t be any life on earth because of these naturally occurring radioactivity, nothing could exist.

Karl Grossman

04:47:36

But when those radioactive poisons went through the half-life went through their, their hazardous lifetimes, then life could begin. And then it goes on by having these nuclear power plants by, by having these reactors, we are recreated the very poisons that precluded life. And this is Rick over not Greenpeace, not beyond nuclear or nears or radiation and public recover then goes on there. I think the human race is going to wreck itself. That’s Hyman Rick, over with a warning to a congressional committee as he retired in 1982. I remember during the first Clinton campaign that notion where it’s the economy stupid here with nuclear technology, nuclear power, it’s the radioactivity stupid it’s radioactivity. It kills life. It destroys life. And the thing is, there’s no need for man-made radioactivity. I mean, we live with still a little bit of radioactivity that comes from the natural environment and so forth.

Karl Grossman

04:48:42

And some people die from it, but to have nuclear power plants visioning uranium Brita’s with Plutonian, these deadly machines, which in an accident will discharge vast amounts of radioactive poison and kill large numbers of, again, it’s Genova a million people dead. And even just in routine operations being allowed to and have to emit radioactive gases water that has become irradiated. I mean, they all should be shut down. And I have found from being involved in this issue for many decades. And when people get to know, when people become aware, talking about game over the game is over.

Libbe HaLevy 

04:49:27

You have certainly been a source of clear, compelling, well thought out brilliantly, well put together writing and presentations on nuclear issues for decades. Now you’ve certainly been a mentor and an educator for me when I first barged into this field after Fukushima. And I always appreciate having the opportunity to speak with you because I know that the information will be complex well thought out well, presented and mind blowing at the same time, even for those of us who are familiar with it. So Carol Grossman just thank you for being you for doing what you do. And of course, as always for being my guest again, this week on nuclear hot seat,

Karl Grossman

05:50:15

Anytime Libby, it’s a pleasure to be with him.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:50:18

That was veteran environmental journalist author and professor Carl Grossman. We’ll have plenty of links up in connection with this interview to Carl’s recent article on embrittlement, which he co-authored with Harvey Wasserman to a video of Arnie Gunderson from 2014, where he graphically explains what embrittlement is and what it does to the cornerstone book by Alexei Yabloko Chernobyl consequences of the catastrophe for people and to the environment and to Carl’s terrific book coverup, which you are not supposed to know about nuclear. The links are to Amazon because they make it easy for me to track down the books, but I encourage you to order them through a local independent bookstore

Announcer

05:51:05

Activists.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:51:13

This is a great heads up from Mary Olson of gender and radiation.org within the past year or so. The NRC has placed thousands of old records into Adam’s it’s digital online library. These documents were previously only accessible by visiting the NRCS public documents room or one of its local public documents rooms and doing the work in person among the records now available in digital form are lots of records on the March, 1979 accident. At three mile island, we will have a link up to Mary’s trail of breadcrumbs through the very convoluted, Hey, it’s coming from the government, very convoluted instructions for actually looking up a specific PDF. No that in the document content search box, you can replace the word radiological, which is what she had previously suggested with other items of interest, and then click on the dark blue search button. That way you’ll get lots of information.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:52:14

All of it, the official and RC documents, the Republic of Marshall Islands, national nuclear commission is holding their annual nuclear victims. Remembrance day on March 1st, 2021. The day is chosen because it commemorates the March 1st, 1954, castle Bravo nuclear tests, the largest nuclear test ever committed by the United States of America. The theme for this year’s event is we are not alone and they are asking other frontline nuclear justice groups to submit a video message of 15 seconds. If they could to stand in solidarity with the Marshall Islands people and this year’s theme, we are not alone. That’s another one of the links we will have up on the website, nuclear hot seat.com under this episode, number 5 0 3, another one of the Kings bay plow share seven. Claire Grady will be starting her prison sentence of one year. And one day on Wednesday, February 10, Grady, along with six, others broke into the world’s largest nuclear submarine base at Kings bay, Georgia on April four of 20, they strong crime tape across the entrance poured vials of their own blood on the ground and stood in front of the entrance, holding a banner, saying the ultimate logic of Trident alumna side members of Ploughshares believed that nuclear weapons are created in a system that is also causing climate change, institutional racism and the detainment of immigrants.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:53:49

All seven of the protesters are facing or have been convicted of conspiracy destruction of property on a Naval installation deprivation of government, property, and trespassing, and ordered to each pay a share of what the government says is the 33,500, $3 and 51 cents that the Navy said it costs to clean and repair the damage caused by the Ploughshares seven. Grady has stated that she believes that spending a year and a day in federal prison will be a learning experience. Quote, this prison time is just another stage of the action and going to King’s bay for me is like going to the head of the beast and say, yes, we will find ourselves in the belly of the beast, our hearts and best wishes go with her. And on this sad note, we mark the passing of Jay Truman, a down winder who was a fierce advocate for cancer victims of atomic testing.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:54:46

Truman famously said, you learn quickly that the first victim of nuclear weapons or nuclear power is the truth. And the first casualty is the government’s ability to tell the truth. Journalist, playwright and fellow down winder. Mary Dickson said he was a down winder who fought like hell for justice. Who’s determined, indefatigable and fierce in his lifelong work on behalf of those who suffered from 928 nuclear blast in Nevada, that spread fallout across the country. Jay Truman was 69 years old. This has been nuclear hot seat for Tuesday, February 9th, 2021 material for this week show has been researched and compiled from nuclear-news.net, Dylan renard.wordpress.com beyond nuclear, the international campaign for the abolition of nuclear weapons, San Clemente green Harold scotland.com fairwinds.org, Washington times.com w T a p.com. Current argus.com Searchlight and m.org. Try dash city herald.com to drive.com. The hill.com the bulletin.org, New York times.com I O M today dot C O dot I M Royal society publishing.org, N D T v.com and the ever co-opted regulatory captured nuclear rubber stamp nuclear regulatory commission.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:56:18

Thanks to all of you for listening and a big shout out to nuclear hot seat listeners and followers around the world in 123 countries on six continents and counting. Now, if you want to make certain that you get nuclear hot seat every week, there’s an easy way to do so. Just go to our website, nuclear hot seat.com. Look for the yellow opt-in box. Put in your first name, put in your email address, and we will send you one email a week. It contains the link to the show and a short rundown on what’s in it, as well as a tweet length post that you can copy and paste and put into social media to help get the show out to others. We really do rely on grassroots activism. And this is one simple step that you can take every week to help us get the word out.

Libbe HaLevy 

05:57:09

Now, there is another way that you can participate. That’s really easy and just a couple of clicks away. If you have a story lead a hunt tip, or a suggestion of someone to interview, send it to us by email [email protected] And remember that if you appreciate weekly verifiable news updates about nuclear issues around the world, just take a moment, go to nuclear, hot seat.com. Look for that big red button, click on it, follow the prompts. Anything you can do to help we’ll help. And we always appreciate your support. Nuclear hot seat is copyright 2021, leaving Columbia Cardistry communications, all rights reserved for affirmation. This is part of street communications, the heart of the art of communicating, reminding you that we can always come up with the date that a nuclear emergency begins, but we can never come up with a date that it’s over because once it starts, it’s never over. There you go. There has been your nuclear wake-up call. So don’t go back to sleep because we are all in the nuclear hot seat,

Announcer

05:58:25

Clear hot seat. What are those people thinking? Nuclear hot seat. What have those boys been breaking their hot seat? Ms. Sinking, our time to act is shrinking, but Hotsy, it’s the bomb.